New Rules - How Should Armagh Set Up? What Will Be The Big Changes Tactically Nationwide?

[Diarmi]

OK everyone, I thought this is a good opportunity to see who has the best tactical brain on the forum and to keep the minds ticking over Christmas.

This is a chance for everyone to put their opinions and ideas out there for future scrutiny.

Will we see a different emphasis on fitness? Will we see different training for different positions? Will we see the nippy corner forward back in vogue and therefore the sticky corner back? Will we see new players included just for their arial ability? Will we see the "bear in the Square" and therefore more Francies again? Will we see long range kickers getting their positions ahead of the athlete? How will affect goalkeepers both with kickouts and shot stopping? Or will the coaches and managers find a way to eliminate the risk and we end up back where we began?

Over to you brain boxes, let's see how smart you all are.........

 

[jpowell100]

I would be very interested to see players like Murnin and Turbo left inside the 45 the whole time to see what damage they could do. Both very dangerous in there. Even Rian oneill at times too, though his long range shooting is an obvious asset

 

[Armaghball]

Think we have the players to suit. Unfortunately might be bad news for Blaine as the goalkeeper will be massive next year and Ethan just plays that role better, he’ll be an extra man and be able to get shots away for the 2 pointers. Going to be very interesting to see how managers approach it.

 

[William Of Orange]

Think we have the players to suit. Unfortunately might be bad news for Blaine as the goalkeeper will be massive next year and Ethan just plays that role better, he’ll be an extra man and be able to get shots away for the 2 pointers. Going to be very interesting to see how managers approach it.

I wouldnt agree on the keeper front , I think Blaine is more accurate in his kick outs which will be more important now that the short option will be gone , Armagh were very good and scoring from short kick outs moving the ball up the field at pace and setting up in defence with all players behind the 45 which teams found very hard to break down , so the system will have to be tweaked , having said all that we have forwards and the midfielders that the nes rules will suit -and realistically everyone will be in the same boat

 

[Armaghball]

I wouldnt agree on the keeper front , I think Blaine is more accurate in his kick outs which will be more important now that the short option will be gone , Armagh were very good and scoring from short kick outs moving the ball up the field at pace and setting up in defence with all players behind the 45 which teams found very hard to break down , so the system will have to be tweaked , having said all that we have forwards and the midfielders that the nes rules will suit -and realistically everyone will be in the same boat

Yeah fair enough, obviously it’s for everyone but do think a keeper that can get forward and get scores will be a big help given he can’t be marked or it will give an extra man elsewhere. Seen to great effect with Morgan in the trial games,

Rian, Oisin, Soupy, Turbo, Grimley, McCambridge, Forker and more all very capable of scoring from outside the arc, plenty of forwards capable of winning their own ball and plenty of lads capable of hitting long range kick passes as well.

Will be interesting to see how the changes fare.

 

[Wide ball]

For me after seeing the rules in the railway cup, it looked like you need a big athletic team, and having long range shooters, I'd say are full back line won't change much and will be relatively the same as before, think Rafferty could be back in nets as with the goalkeeper rule it gives us an option of an extra man in attack making it 12 on 11, I'd say our full forward line will be more quick players so turbitt and conaty, with the middle and half forward line being athletic guys who can run all day (not much difference from now), if they can fetch and kick long range that could be the deciding bit, I'd say the 2 O'Neill's and grimley those type of players and then half back line big runners so maybe mcquillan and jarly og, but really hard to call as the new rules will speed game up and gives a couple different ways to play, it is exciting but think the most interesting thing in the league will be the likes of what teams commit the goalie into the attack, I'd of preferred if they said goalie can't go past the 21 or something and can't take the back pass, the other rules I think suit Armagh, we have big men, have long range shooters have play makers, really looking forward to see how we go,

 

[PatMustard]

I can see the game played a lot in the third quarter, in and around the 50 yard arc.

I’m not sure we’ll see as many long balls kicked in to the big FF as we think. Working a 2 pointer is nearly as rewarding as a goal, and less chance of losing possession.

 

[JoeH]

I think a more defensive game is in store with the role of the roaming goalkeeper as an over lapping player being key.
The rules suggest more openness - I think it'll be the opposite at inter county level
It may open up as teams chase the last ten minutes

 

[Wide ball]

I think a more defensive game is in store with the role of the roaming goalkeeper as an over lapping player being key.
The rules suggest more openness - I think it'll be the opposite at inter county level
It may open up as teams chase the last ten minutes

I think most teams will defend with 12 zonal around the 2 point arc, maybe let teams go wide, I can see alot of keep ball around outside the arc, I hope I am wrong but if that materialises in the league they will change a few rules for championship,

 

[Armaghball]

No matter what rules come in, keeping the ball is key- if you have it the other team doesn’t and can’t score. (Obviously)

I think they need to loosen up the tackle abit, more physical contact which will lead to more 1v1 battles, more turnovers and more scores.

 

[PatMustard]

No matter what rules come in, keeping the ball is key- if you have it the other team doesn’t and can’t score. (Obviously)
.

Yeah, that’s exactly it.

As @Wide ball said, instead of 15v15 around the 50 yard line, it will be 12v12 around the 50 yard arc. Little will change. A possession based game will still be priority. So we’ll see more of the same tactics as before, and more, as there will be 6 players less in that area.

It’s just moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic-type rule changes.

 

[PatMustard]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but isn't the captain only allowed to speak to the referee under the new rules?

So, that would rule out the goalkeeper or the full back and full forward line. They'd be knackered having to constantly jog back and forward to listen to the referee. Plus, it would waste a lot of time, and we'd be at danger of quick frees being taken while the captain is out of position.

I'm assuming Aidan Forker will remain captain as long as he continues to start. If he's not playing, then a player from 5 to 12, where they'd be likely nearer the play/referee.

 

[Patrick-Armagh]

While I think we undoubtedly have players who can thrive under the new rules I'd also have some concerns about how the team will adapt to the rules. With three up, we have the pace and size of the like of Turbitt, Murnin, Campbell, Conaty, McQuillan and Oisin O'Neill who we could hit with long passes and they'd be able to win ball. You then have players with lots of attacking attributes to get around the ball winner and make things happen. I do wonder how we will defend in this situation. The likes of Burns, Forker, McKay and McCambridge are all clearly top class inter county defenders. But our system and style of play really helped them out. Seeing them having to defend one on one could be a risk.

 

[Armaghball]

I don’t think there will be as much 1v1 defending as people think or is hoped for with these proposals. Teams are still going to get the bodies back, will just be more space. The openness of the trial games won’t happen in a real game I don’t think

 

[Patrick-Armagh]

Having those extra bodies back meant that more space was clogged up, so one v one battles rarely happened because after an attacker won the ball, while he may have thought about taking on his man he would quickly see that the space beyond the defender was blocked or could be shut down very quickly, so the ball was just recycled. Not having those spaces filled with as many bodies, should see more players taking on their man to get a quick shot off, because there is that split second and yard of space beyond the defender to do it, which didn't exist before. So a lot of defending was a case of just slowing the attacker up and showing them into a mass of bodies which they would want to avoid. I don't think we'll see too many instances of players winning the ball, turning, running, jinking in and out and then going for goal, because in that time more bodies will be coming back into the defence. But I do think you'll see players seeing the potential for more shots to be taken, so our defenders are going to have to be that much tighter and really up their defensive game and not rely as much on just sheer weight of numbers being back in defence to put attackers off.

 

[Diarmi]

You would imagine there will be more space somewhere between the new arc and the 14 yard line. That space can be used to get shots away or for runners off the shoulder to run into. We could also see more loading of a side like Armagh used this year. I would also image we will see the three players being rotated to help lads get their wind back.

 

[niall1980]

I dont think we will see settled tactics until the championship and even later maybe. This year will be very much trial and error I think. If only we had a preseason competition to work on things..............

 

[GAAGael]

I dont think we will see settled tactics until the championship and even later maybe. This year will be very much trial and error I think. If only we had a preseason competition to work on things..............

All county teams will have numerous behind doors games, on their own terms. Won't make one bit of difference not having McKenna cup

 

[Hoops]

The short kick out is going nowhere.
Teams will want the front 3 to put on a bit of a press, but everyone else will pull back into a defensive shape. The same logic from before still applies, the risk of conceding off a long kick out is far too high, so unless you're likely to win the midfield battle or the game situation forces you to take that risk, you'll choose to avoid it where possible. The front 3 can drop right back to near the half way line remember, not too different to what teams did before. That's probably close enough to fight for a break ball.
An opposition kickout is still a defensive play. You're living in cuckoo-land if you think any manager will simply allow an opposition to repeatedly lump it over half their team and easily attack an exposed full back line.

Ideally you'd let the opposition take a short kickout, progress the ball slowly up the field and bring 12 attackers + goalkeeper into your half, then you'd win the ball off them and hit them on the counter. The main difference from when that happened before, is that teams will have a much stronger counter attacking threat because of the 3 up front, so hopefully fewer of those transitions evolve into slow phases of play and we see more shots.
I think to counter this, we'll see a 4th defender stay back and hold a 4v3 in the defensive half of the team with the ball. That would both act as cover if the team in possession lose the ball and can also be an out-ball to safely keep possession. That'll force the team without the ball to decide whether to push a man right out on him and leave space closer to their goal, or let them keep the ball out the field.

Re rafferty - he's the ideal man for this. He's been recovered from injury for a long time now and is much more athletic than any other goalkeeper like morgan or beggan who will try to play the same role. Other teams will be experimenting with an outfielder, and we have one ready to go who's already experienced some huge pressure moments as a goalkeeper. It would be crazy not to play him. He starts for almost every other team in the country.

Our strategy of using the bench and holding players back until the final phase of a game, seemed like it was going to become more popular anyway, as teams generally copy what wins. The combination of an increased potential to score (giving more reward to the risk of holding players back until the game opens up) and the chatter about high speed running meaning players will fatigue quicker, will only make that in-game management even more important. That should be an advantage to us as we have a massive panel with a lot of very athletic players, and we've already been deploying the strategy to see who does well from the start vs the end.

I also think the idea that man-marking is a lost art and corner forwards are going to have a field day in the 3v3 is a bit misguided. We could end up surprised to see how often defenders are able to manage their forward into a situation where they can't get a shot off despite the amount of space there is.

 

[niall1980]

All county teams will have numerous behind doors games, on their own terms. Won't make one bit of difference not having McKenna cup

Id have preferred to have McKenna cup