After all the positive work in the league, we were always set up to fail and now the pressure is piled on. I wouldn't be so quick to get rid of McGeeney yet, will be interesting to see what we can do in the All Ireland Series, hopefully a favourable draw to get confidence back. The grass isn't always greener
ULSTER FOOTBALL CHAMPIONSHIP 2K22
- Thread starter PutTheHighBallInLow
- Start date
desperate performance yesterday.
donegal could have been out of sight at half time, yet we had 3/4 chances at the start of the second half to put pressure on them.
comments on the game, i thought midfield was cleaned out totally as was the winning of teh breaking ball , jemar in my view is too small for the role he is playing and it has showed against donegal and kerry, the switch with campbell should have been made at half time.
tactically we were out witted and our side line who i was behind didnt seem to be able to make a switch to plan b.
we also allowed them to get the ball out too easily in the first half whereas we werent afforded this in the second half .
looking at it in the cold light of day, we were well beaten all over the pitch with say 3/4 players coming out with pass marks.
a disappointing day considering the number of people who travelled with genuine aspirations of a break through
donegal could have been out of sight at half time, yet we had 3/4 chances at the start of the second half to put pressure on them.
comments on the game, i thought midfield was cleaned out totally as was the winning of teh breaking ball , jemar in my view is too small for the role he is playing and it has showed against donegal and kerry, the switch with campbell should have been made at half time.
tactically we were out witted and our side line who i was behind didnt seem to be able to make a switch to plan b.
we also allowed them to get the ball out too easily in the first half whereas we werent afforded this in the second half .
looking at it in the cold light of day, we were well beaten all over the pitch with say 3/4 players coming out with pass marks.
a disappointing day considering the number of people who travelled with genuine aspirations of a break through
CEMan
Member
Can only assume the goal was disallowed because either
a) RoN pulled the ball from the keepers hands which, although not often given, is techncially a free (would also have been a hard one to spot from the distance Deegan was away or
b) a general scramble where ref can't really see what's going on = GK gets the easy call and free out.
Not sure it would have changed a loss into a win, but certainly would have made it a lot more interesting
Many of the old failings seemed to come back - little pressure on kick outs ( when it was applied it worked - go figure), very poor tackling (bar a few excellent disposessions from McCabe, if I rememebr right), way too easy to run through the middle and far too slow getting ball up to the forwards.
DngG certainly would have been pleased to see RoN playing out around HF/MF for most of the game as well....given the panic him at FF caused (briefly)
ON the plus side - there is definately the foundations of a very good team there - I don't buy this 'we don't have the players' stuff at all....but there also seems to be a real lack of eradicting old issues and failing to push on (in Championship at least) - good players can only take you so far.....
a) RoN pulled the ball from the keepers hands which, although not often given, is techncially a free (would also have been a hard one to spot from the distance Deegan was away or
b) a general scramble where ref can't really see what's going on = GK gets the easy call and free out.
Not sure it would have changed a loss into a win, but certainly would have made it a lot more interesting
Many of the old failings seemed to come back - little pressure on kick outs ( when it was applied it worked - go figure), very poor tackling (bar a few excellent disposessions from McCabe, if I rememebr right), way too easy to run through the middle and far too slow getting ball up to the forwards.
DngG certainly would have been pleased to see RoN playing out around HF/MF for most of the game as well....given the panic him at FF caused (briefly)
ON the plus side - there is definately the foundations of a very good team there - I don't buy this 'we don't have the players' stuff at all....but there also seems to be a real lack of eradicting old issues and failing to push on (in Championship at least) - good players can only take you so far.....
I would temper that positivity a small bit.
In addition to the three named checked above Rafferty, Mackin, McCabe, Grimley, Hall, Nugent and Campbell are all also well into the second halves of the their careers. They are not young, never mind very young. I don't see an awful lot of scope for improvement with these lads.
That's over half of the men we used yesterday at, or passed, their prime. We are not a young team by any measure.
ShiftYa
Well-Known Member
McKay is around 27 also, then take into account the likes of Soupy and shields who are subs that are in their inter-county career tailends
KilleavyGael
Active Member
Most of the team aren't youngsters andyes we have been poor at underage for a long time - and when we were last good at underage we got basically no value from it (Morgan and Grugan the only 2009 Minor winners to have a career at it?)
But the actual young players we do have - Turbo, Kelly, Rian are up there with anything any county is producing.
But the actual young players we do have - Turbo, Kelly, Rian are up there with anything any county is producing.
gograngego
Member
when is the qualifier draw?
martin
Member
2009 minor team
S O’Reilly,
K Downey,
R Finnegan,
K Nugent,
D McKenna,
N Rowland,
J Morgan,
P Carragher (0-01),
J Donnelly,
R Grugan (0-01, f),
A Murnin (0-01),
C King, R Tasker (0-03),
E McVerry (0-03, 2f),
G McParland.
Roland and Murnin were on that team and still playing today. few others got a decent run with the Seniors - McParland, McVerry. Maybe others as well.
Armaghmad00
Active Member
Do you know which weekend it is ?
Armaghball
Well-Known Member
The lads bound to be playing for clubs this week then!
Is Tasker available for selection?
JoeH
Well-Known Member
It's a split season so I'd be surprised if any county player in the country plays for their club until they're out of the championship
It's what was voted for.
I said before this split season won't work and this is one of the reasons
Management have been very reserved in making comments regarding what occurred in Letterkenny, for reasons that I fully understand. Did those events and the unfolding narratives though impact upon the mindset of some of the team and officials, both yesterday and within officialdom within the association. Perhaps if management revealed their understanding and views on what occurred a number of weeks ago and in the interim, we can galvanise and give true performances as the campaign unfolds. The team and management need our support like never before, let's create a siege mentality for the qualifiers and beyond.
Depressing day all round. Great weather, great support and great expectations. But it all came to nothing , yes nothing as we were bullied, chased, out run, out thought ( both on and off the field)and outplayed for the vast majority of the game. It felt like Brewster park 2018 all over again only saving grace being it was a Division 1 team and not Division 2 or 3( Fermanagh ??). I haven’t posted much this good while but the sense of disappointment in all the posts is clearly here for all to read. From that great day in January in Croke Park etc I was happy that at last we were competing. We were playing in the big league and doing more than well. I didn’t think we would the All -Ireland or evening the national league but I did have high hopes of a possible Ulster title. A realistic chance of a final appearance and that’s why disappointment was etched on mine and many of the faces leaving a sunny but cold Ballybofey ground. We have had so many many Monday’s like this over the past 13 years.
We lost all the battles yesterday and whether we loose the war or not remains to be seen.
The psychological build up to the game was lost with the letterkenny debacle. Bcb1 pointed this out as to Peter Canavan in his summing up of the game. I feared we had handed Donegal a victims card when the suspensions were lifted. Rightly or wrongly and I may add here why wouldn’t any manager want his best players for a crunch championship game. Why wouldn’t they appeal. We’d all do it but in doing so we unknowingly handed them a stick to beat us.
Ethan Rafferty certainly saved us a point or two but it has to be said we lost so many kick outs . The ploy of playing Niall Grimley half back definitely back fired. Niall looked unsure and he was used to try and cancel Langan out. While it’s always good to look at opponents and try to counteract we focused to much and it simply didn’t work. Our tactics were cancelled out by Donegals strong running game and it looked as only a matter of time before they majored.
We didn’t have anyone to inject pace into a pedestrian forward line with only Grugan and his vision rising to the task. Soupy was the one player who did possess that and did it two or three times. Conor Turbitt in the first half showed his marker a clean pair of heels. But that was it . We stopped ,turned played it back. Yes the 10 mins in the second half gave us the required urgency the bite and the will to win in this type of cauldron. But once we didn’t come up with the goods Donegal seized their chance, put four between us. Game over. Our purple patch yielded zero, we gave them our best shot and we missed the target. They didn’t and there but for the grace of god they have could have left us heading to the exits with 15 to go.
All along at the back of my head I kept saying how come we have reached these new heights with basically the same team that had taken championship beatings years previous. On Sunday I found my answer.
We will continue to take a few scalps no doubt but for us to be a constant serious threat I’m not so sure.
What depressed me even more was watching our minor team on Sat evening . We were outclassed all over the field and we cannot blame the management.
I watched a schools cup game two weeks ago involving the college and a Derry team and again well beaten by players who were more comfortable on the ball and basically knew when to come off the shoulder, track carry the ball , off load etc and compete honestly but aggressively.
We have been in only one underage final that I can think of in ten years. I may be wrong but I don’t think so.
I see all the young players coming through.
It has to be said we need to improve our coaching at club level. Some clubs do coach to a high level. Many don’t. We have far to many amalgamations at under age .and yes many of these are a definite necessity but not enough young boys are playing Gaelic games. The development squads or the academy’s can only work with what the clubs send through and the talent is not there . It doesn’t matter if we get Jim Gavin up to manage we are there alongside Antrim Fermanagh when it’s comes down to the heels of the hunt. We have not won an Ulster title at any levels for years.
Oisin McConville and Barry O hagan did massive work with our under 20s but we didn’t have enough talent. Some but not enough. We really need to get this debate going and take a real in-depth study of our games in the county. It may well be the dev squads and it may not. Only for Cross we haven’t had a club title either. Let’s get coaches into the schools and clubs. Dev programme at club levels first and foremost. Monitor what is happening in the schools and clubs intervene when needed. But anyway that’s a debate for down the road but one that needs to be had.
Anyway sorry for the rant but it helps soothe the pain of yesterday.
We lost all the battles yesterday and whether we loose the war or not remains to be seen.
The psychological build up to the game was lost with the letterkenny debacle. Bcb1 pointed this out as to Peter Canavan in his summing up of the game. I feared we had handed Donegal a victims card when the suspensions were lifted. Rightly or wrongly and I may add here why wouldn’t any manager want his best players for a crunch championship game. Why wouldn’t they appeal. We’d all do it but in doing so we unknowingly handed them a stick to beat us.
Ethan Rafferty certainly saved us a point or two but it has to be said we lost so many kick outs . The ploy of playing Niall Grimley half back definitely back fired. Niall looked unsure and he was used to try and cancel Langan out. While it’s always good to look at opponents and try to counteract we focused to much and it simply didn’t work. Our tactics were cancelled out by Donegals strong running game and it looked as only a matter of time before they majored.
We didn’t have anyone to inject pace into a pedestrian forward line with only Grugan and his vision rising to the task. Soupy was the one player who did possess that and did it two or three times. Conor Turbitt in the first half showed his marker a clean pair of heels. But that was it . We stopped ,turned played it back. Yes the 10 mins in the second half gave us the required urgency the bite and the will to win in this type of cauldron. But once we didn’t come up with the goods Donegal seized their chance, put four between us. Game over. Our purple patch yielded zero, we gave them our best shot and we missed the target. They didn’t and there but for the grace of god they have could have left us heading to the exits with 15 to go.
All along at the back of my head I kept saying how come we have reached these new heights with basically the same team that had taken championship beatings years previous. On Sunday I found my answer.
We will continue to take a few scalps no doubt but for us to be a constant serious threat I’m not so sure.
What depressed me even more was watching our minor team on Sat evening . We were outclassed all over the field and we cannot blame the management.
I watched a schools cup game two weeks ago involving the college and a Derry team and again well beaten by players who were more comfortable on the ball and basically knew when to come off the shoulder, track carry the ball , off load etc and compete honestly but aggressively.
We have been in only one underage final that I can think of in ten years. I may be wrong but I don’t think so.
I see all the young players coming through.
It has to be said we need to improve our coaching at club level. Some clubs do coach to a high level. Many don’t. We have far to many amalgamations at under age .and yes many of these are a definite necessity but not enough young boys are playing Gaelic games. The development squads or the academy’s can only work with what the clubs send through and the talent is not there . It doesn’t matter if we get Jim Gavin up to manage we are there alongside Antrim Fermanagh when it’s comes down to the heels of the hunt. We have not won an Ulster title at any levels for years.
Oisin McConville and Barry O hagan did massive work with our under 20s but we didn’t have enough talent. Some but not enough. We really need to get this debate going and take a real in-depth study of our games in the county. It may well be the dev squads and it may not. Only for Cross we haven’t had a club title either. Let’s get coaches into the schools and clubs. Dev programme at club levels first and foremost. Monitor what is happening in the schools and clubs intervene when needed. But anyway that’s a debate for down the road but one that needs to be had.
Anyway sorry for the rant but it helps soothe the pain of yesterday.
Peter grimes
Well-Known Member
Very happy to give those 2 a mention. Morgan stood out for his forward running. No other player tried to run between the lines to get forward momentum and simple give and go alternatives.
The big danger yesterday was a slow and ponderous build up that gave Donegal all the time they needed to filter men back and get us playing laterally. They just kept showing us the outside and ushered us towards the sideline. Can’t think of any examples of ball kicked to midfield or half forwards.
Im really not sure if we planned to stop doing the things we are good at on the day when tactically it was most required or what ever plan we did have didn’t survive the first 15 mins.
I have no criticism or management in terms of selection. We would all do things slightly differently but I dot think any major errors were made in that front.
You could question conditioning yesterday but tactics is where the main shortcomings were. Our approach to both sides kick outs was hopelessly flawed. The failure to get ball to the middle third was massive as it pushed us into a packed defence and then down the side into non threatening areas. There was also a marked difference in the tackling of both teams yesterday.
I wouldn’t be giving up on this team yet. But we need to tighten up in lots of areas.
gael_force_orchard
Well-Known Member
Qualifiers not until 4th of June, and if we win round 1 then its 11th june for round 2. The players need to be released to their clubs. They need football in the interim 6 week period
Escape to Victory neededIs Tasker available for selection?
The failure to compete in the air at midfield is a constant problem. Even in our successful league start it seems to have been forgotten that in the second halves Dublin and Tyrone pushed up on our kickouts and we struggled. Monaghan noted that and pushed up from the first minute and Darren Hughes had a field day. Our neighbours had this problem and they went out and found Kennedy and Kilpatrick. We need to find a similar pairing.