Ulster Senior Football Championship 2020

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
Who knows but they would have picked up better results generally. And have

I don't think they would have.

2014 we had a defence and one or two forwards. Today we know we don't have a good defence but have good forwards. All any team ever had to do to beat us was cut the supply off to the forwards and it was game over for us and they did it so effectively.
 

Rufus T Firefly

Well-Known Member
I also disagree with you on the ref. Saw a couple of baffling decisions that went against us in a row and thought Murphy should have been booked in first half. Otherwise our problems with the ref were they same as they were most days ie more of an “us” problem and less of a “ref” problem

I knew I shouldn't have mentioned the ref as I knew that slant would have been put on it. My mistake and won't happen again.
 

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
I knew I shouldn't have mentioned the ref as I knew that slant would have been put on it. My mistake and won't happen again.
When your own team is involved you should never criticise the ref until at least 1000 days have passed.

When your own team is involved you are not a reliable witness. That is you as in you, me and everybody else
 

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
I don't think they would have.

2014 we had a defence and one or two forwards. Today we know we don't have a good defence but have good forwards. All any team ever had to do to beat us was cut the supply off to the forwards and it was game over for us and they did it so effectively.
My point is I think today’s team is better
 
Very bad result today! Too many players underperformed. 2nd 1/4 killed Armagh. Kickout strategy was non existent. Surely our management team knew Donegal were very strong around the middle! Lots of negatives and very few positives.
 
Maybe too many players not playing at the top level within the county?
Out of the 20 players used today, only 10 played Senior Club Championship this year!

Also, why does McGeeney name the wrong team all the time?!
 

armaghlad

Active Member
On the whole I think we have a number of obvious places for improvement in terms of personnel. As I see it, a couple of positions need urgent examination but I won’t name names because ultimately that was a collectively poor performance and it is unfair to single out players who put in a huge effort today.

That said, barring a major overhaul, we will struggle and continue to paper over the cracks. People are quick to question the tactical nous of the management which is well justified; but they also need to factor in the execution of such tactics. Donegal’s runners from half back had a field day and they simply weren’t dealt with, 1-4 conceded from Mogan and McHugh. Our kickout strategy seemed ropey at the best of times and we were cleaned out in the middle - both their midfielders got on the score sheet.

While the scoreline and the nature of the defeat was frustrating, it raises a lot of questions about this teams ability to compete with the top counties, even if everything went our way today I still don’t think we have the ingredients for an Ulster title. Whether it’s on the management side or the playing side I still can’t make up my mind
 

Big Jim

Well-Known Member
Poor enough alright that. I felt with about 10 minutes or so left in the first half we had given up and it was over. At no point after that did it look like we were getting back in.

Soupy was unbelievably poor today which was so disappointing as he really stepped it up this year.

Was there an issue with the team? The body language even during what you could see of the warm up before the game didn't inspire confidence.

Coldrick is a ref that tends not to favour one team and other than a few baffling decisions (and we can't be inside his head and see what he sees or hears from his officials) I don't believe he was overly bad. Certainly didn't cost us the game. If I remember right from the Twitter graphic, we got about the same amount of frees.

Hate to do this, but Blaine was to blame directly for several of their scores. Don't remember exactly, but I know he drove the ball straight to Donegal on at least 3 occasions [that I can think of] and they scored almost instantly. No player gave him options either which didn't help, but Donegal pushed up on us all the time and they knew we would struggle and boy did we struggle.

Our midfield was woeful. Either that or they were non existent.

Rory Grugan had a seriously off day. Rian had a seriously off day. Oisin actually was really hard working by the look of things.

Was there an issue with the team? (yes I have put that down twice)

I thought Aidan Forker was just about the best player we had on show, and gave Murphy no respect at all. He certainly wasn't intimidated by him. Yes he was rugby tackled by Murphy early on and Murphy knew he was wrong as he started shouting immediately at the ref to distract him - clever as it worked! Didn't notice the ball throwing at the end, but they did both shake hands with Barry Cassidy talking to both and Aidan obviously didn't take kindly to what he said.

I'll now concede and join the voices that Geezer has maybe done as much as he can with this team. Not for the reasons others have said, but simply because he's tried [hard] and seems to be static. Whilst acknowledging he has taken us to division 1 which will most likely see him given another extension, at the very least his backroom needs a shake up - real good one. Jim McCorry should maybe stay for his experience, but Denis?? Not sure what he contributes although he's a likeable guy and a county employee, so most likely will stay too! What has Paddy McKeever added? What high level experience has he brought to the table? Same thing with John Toal. These were all great servants to our county and still are, but other than the promotions, we are still hurting today. We always seem to have have a lot of stats people and GPS stuff. What exactly do those people and the equipment add? I know almost all counties use this with similar personnel, but is that what brings the like of Dublin success or is it simply just the players.

Strength and conditioning gets a regular mention, but I think I'm right in saying it's the yoga professional that looks after that. The same lass that was around in '02. Is that a weakness? I'm sure she's good at her job, but is it another area to improve?

Someone from outside the county is the call, but there are some within that know success or at least relative success. Yes the McEntees are great lads and I believe they have something to give. Still not convinced that they would take it on though - at any price! What about the McGilly lad from Annaghmore? He's been successful at Sigerson and also got Moy an All Ireland title. I know he's with Down at the minute, but has he ever been approached?

I don't think Geezer should be run out of town. I'd prefer continuity, but maybe a different voice inside the head, can ignite a spark. Then again, maybe it's a complete emptying of the cupboard and a few new brooms is what is called for. No answers to that, just hurting with disappointment this evening and not because I really thought we would win, but more I thought we'd give a better account of ourselves. A more passionate account. A more proud account. We're a proud, passionate county, but looking at the tanking today and compare that to the last result Donegal got against the neighbours, makes you wonder where the passion and pride was today.

Ah well, we breathe and go again next term! Merry Christmas everyone, wherever you are!
 

gar

Member
Very disappointed today. Second and if possible third fiddle in a game that apart from the first five to ten mins we were destroyed. I really believed we cud put it up to them. Didn’t and looked every bit of a team on the end of a 12 point defeat. The problems in Armagh football were cruelly exposed there today.

The problems go much deeper than that what we witnessed. Declan Bonner has worked at underage level with a lot of those Donegal and with a good degree of success I must add. In comparison our record at underage level this past 8 years or so has been abysmal.

Apart from out u 20s reaching a final two years ago it has been very poor and I stand corrected. Every year at u 14 level I have taken county squads to play in blitzs everywhere. Tyrone, Donegal are streets ahead. Basic skills , handling etc much better .

A root and branch review has to be carried out. Some men are doing excellent work but we need to examine why we are not producing enough quality players.

If what I’m doing isn’t what’s required I’ll gladly stand aside and gave way to a better system. I’d be the first one to question it.

Our clubs apart from Cross are way behind at ulster club level and Cross are slipping. It is depressing but back to the match today and I felt that Brendan Donaghy has been humiliated by Kieran McGeeney. Fit and raring to go but hasn’t seen a moment of game time in the last four matches. His physical presence and know how and leadership qualities were sorely missed. I was really looking forward to our journey into Div 1, now I’m not so sure. Anyway roll on late Jan Feb or whenever.
 

Manjet

New Member
Look I’m not a regular contributor on here and have kept my powder dry. Agree that McGeeney has taken this team as far as he can. Time to call it a day and give someone else a chance. He has had 6 years and we still can’t tackle, beggars belief what they do in training. Some of our players are nowhere near county standard but we persist with them game after game, at least we called them ashore early today.
 

bcb1

Well-Known Member
@gar your comments about the underage structures are absolutely spot on. From watching and being involved at coaching under age I believe that not enough is being done. The schools are the key and the reality is that apart from the recent success of St Ronan’s there is no strong and continues success at schools levels. The Newry schools have fallen away, as have St Pats. St Paul’s have limited success. The 2002 team had squad had the Geezer, McEntees, McNultys, O Rourke’s, Barry Duffy, and Oisín (albeit for only a few years) from the Abbey, Tierney, Marsden and McGrane all starred for St Colman’s. That’s a serious bedrock from 2 strong schools. All played together at a variety of levels for school, club and county. This has dried up significantly, particularly from the Abbey.

I have said it before and will say it again, the 2 most consistently successful underage clubs in the county are ourselves and CE yet not one from either club is involved at any great level at county coaching. This is wrong. There are serious questions have to be raised about what is happening at the structure of the underage coaching.
 

Manjet

New Member
Gar is spot on went to U14 blitz in garvaghey last year tyrone had Mickey Harte and Gavin devlin looking after one team and Mattie Donnelly and Peter Harte looking after their other team . We had good men looking after our teams and they did their best. The tyrone managers knew every kids name our coaches calling our kids by numbers and by the way no sign of our senior manager or development officer mr Hollywood ( he couldn’t run a bath by the way) at any of these blitzes
 

ragingbull

Well-Known Member
Campbell has probably lost all his hunger this year for the county after give it all for the clans in this year's Armagh intermediate championship,its not easy given it all to your club then expecting to do the same for the county its like starting all over again so it is sure
 
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