Allianz Football League 2022 Division 1

Patrick-Armagh

Well-Known Member
I thought Rafferty played well too. Going for long jaunts up the field isn't what we want to see and he hasn't really been called into action yet in terms of shot stopping. However, I'm willing to give him a few more games to see how it goes. Blaine Hughes hasn't had any competition for years and that's not very healthy. I've been frustrated with him at times in terms of some of his kick outs, the length of time he has taken to get them away (as much to with the outfield players giving him options I know) and some of his decision making. It's such a horrible position to play as any mistakes or magnified compared to other positions on the field. Rafferty looks more substantial in the goal and his kick outs have been generally excellent. Let's see how he goes in the next few games, with no pressure on the team. Hughes could well be the keeper come Championship, but I don't think Rafferty has looked out of place in goal so far.
 

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
In fairness he (or someone anyway) dealt with the high balls well on Saturday but for me Blaine hasn’t put a foot wrong bar one or two poor kickouts vs Monaghan.
That is the problem there though. Those two poor kick-outs could have resulted in a score and won us the game. We are getting to that stage where we are losing by fine margins - which is great, but we need to minimise them. Our defence has been exceptional this year and very few chances on goal from the opposition as a result. There could be an argument made for knowing what Hughes' weaknesses are in goal and therefore we can create strategies to reduce its influence. It concerns me we do not know what Rafferty's are and we could be a game away from a hiding.
 

Armaghball

Well-Known Member
That is the problem there though. Those two poor kick-outs could have resulted in a score and won us the game. We are getting to that stage where we are losing by fine margins - which is great, but we need to minimise them. Our defence has been exceptional this year and very few chances on goal from the opposition as a result. There could be an argument made for knowing what Hughes' weaknesses are in goal and therefore we can create strategies to reduce its influence. It concerns me we do not know what Rafferty's are and we could be a game away from a hiding.
Show me a keeper that’ll have 100% kick out retention. Not even Stephen Cluxton gives you that.
 

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
Show me a keeper that’ll have 100% kick out retention. Not even Stephen Cluxton gives you that.
Not really expecting 100% success but there were two kicks in that game that went to nobody because I remember thinking to myself Hughes got criticised for the same mistakes. I get that fortune favours the brave and sometimes we need to take a risky pass but we were against a team that gave up the battle as soon as they went behind imo. Going back to defence, I think we could have a dwarf in goal at the minute and still not concede as our defence has been so good but again this will always need minor improvements so our defence isn't stale and keeps opposition guessing.
 

Dylan53

Member
What I don’t understand is what adavantages Rafferty gives us, bar maybe a longer kickout. For an outfield player he looks extremely uncomfortable on the ball at times, 2 or 3 times he was soloing the other night and fumbled it, also kicked a couple of kickpasses straight to Kildare men.

Definitely not as good on the ball as Hughes, who against Tyrone I thought gave us that option of an extra man without taking a risk. His kickouts are also far more accurate.

A top team would have punished us far more the other night.
It was bizarre really. I counted 3 loose solos from him, he looked extremely panicked on the ball which is strange from an intercounty outfield player
 

h754136

Active Member
The Rafferty thing isn't very difficult to figure out. He has something that is a big weakness in Hughes' game: distance off the tee.

Hughes is a very decent keeper and has been gradually improving over the years, but he has never had distance in his locker. This leaves the whole kick out strategy very vulnerable when opponents press high. See the second half v Tyrone, and much of the game against Monaghan.

Rafferty has that same option in his arsenal that both Morgan and Beggan have when faced with a high press: booming a ball 80 yards over the press into the oceans of space left in behind. This puts manners on the opposition and forces them to reconsider the high press, which subsequently makes it easier to get your kick outs away.

The dalliances up the field are neither here nor there. Rafferty has been given a chance simply because McGeeney suspects he is a better fit with our kick out strategy. We'll see if that turns out to be the case.
 

gael_force_orchard

Well-Known Member
Rafferty played well in nets on Saturday evening. We lost 2 of our own kickouts the whole night from what I can remember and 1 of those was as a direct handling error from Rowland. So Rafferty lost one kickout. He was solid under any shots that dropped short and he gave an option. Second half he read an extremely dangerous ball in and come and cleared 2 players and punched the ball a solid distance to one of our own players. Give him another couple of games in the league. Conditions for kick outs on saturday where shocking yet Raffertys were solid. He played well, and the extra solo will be coached out. Hughes now has competition and its a good place to be. We are safe in the league so no harm in experimenting a bit now. We have a free hit against Kerry so lets give Rafferty another chance.
 
I don’t understand that give Rafferty a chance as a free hit. Management have selected him in two games that determined division one status so they aren’t exactly taking a punt in their opinion.

It is a difficult one as the goalkeeper slot doesn’t exactly lend itself to experimentation like other outfield selections. Instead of being more sure as the season progresses towards championship we are becoming more unsure in a key position. From what I have seen neither has done any different from the other which makes it more bemusing that a change has been made. A number of armagh retained kickouts on Saturday were from break balls, had they went the other way we’d be hearing a different narrative.

A huge amount on kickouts relies on outfield players making themselves genuinely available and providing options for the goalkeeper. If they don’t it’s 50:50 and hunting down breaks. If in the tapes the management can see that there were opportunities to get out and the goalkeeper didn’t take them then that’s fair enough. But I haven’t seen them so it’s a flip of a coin between the keepers but it’s a costly flip if confidence is damaged and unnecessary pressure brought on internally.

If you were playing against a keeper that isn’t as accurate going short and prefers going long You’d be setting traps to force mistakes while flooding the midfield. The game is all about being versatile now particularly at the top level. Have we got that with Rafferty in goal? Time will tell.
 

Big Jim

Well-Known Member
That was a bloody good win in those conditions. I thought we played quite well also. We forced kildare to take pot shots with the wind in the first half yet we worked scoring positions better in the second. Hard to pick players out after a good win, but i thought both Tiernan Kelly and Ciaran Mackin were excellent. I also thought Mc Cabe and Forker had excellent games in the backine. A word on Joe McQuillan. That refereeing perfomance cannot be laughed at or juat brushed aside by the powers that be. It was absolutely shocking. Another poster said borderline cheating,I will go one further, he was match fixing, he gave 6 easy easy easy soft scoring frees against us tonight that i juat cant fathom and gave us nothing. It was blatant cheating. He is a disgrace to the gaa.
Funny thing is though GFO, until the incident with McQuillan and Geezer I actually thought he wasn't too bad. Maybe it was a spark that made me look at him and now no matter who he is in the middle for, he is dire. I don't comment on refs at all. It's unfair as they have enough pressure and a thankless job, but that muppet is truly poor and yet despite that we managed to beat him by, with a few exceptions, not giving him clear chances to stop us. I'll take that. He's like that other idiot Cassidy and his brutal performance again on Sunday. Nuff said.
I also saw the following on Twitter which I thought was quite funny:

"Not a Kildare or Armagh supporter but I had to message the GaA about the horrible refereeing standard at their game on Saturday evening. He didn't seem to understand allowing for conditions. He also didn't seem to realise that the same rules applied to both teams. Their reply was as expected "Thank you for contacting us. We cannot comment on individuals contributing to our games and hope you realise the importance of each individual involved. Without these members of our organisation would not continue to function". I just replied , aye but if you turn supporters away from watching or attending because of stupid officials where will the money come from to keep your precious organisation running? Silence. What a surprise"
 

Big Jim

Well-Known Member
Tyrone in a relegation battle.

If Mayo really want that NFL final place they have to beat Tyrone.

Tyrone would then have to beat Kerry.



The Dublin win has made things interesting. Donegal are not as safe as they might think with five points. Dublin still need to win and could beat Donegal next weekend meaning Donegal would have to play us in a survival game. In fact, Armagh could have a hand in deciding Tyrone's NFL fate.

If Monaghan beat Kildare then they are safe. It would leave Dublin, Kildare, Tyrone and Donegal in a relegation battle.
Hmmmm! As if we would want to do that. It's not as if they did that to us after Niall Grimley got a goal to draw in Omagh a few years ago.....or did they??
 

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
Funny thing is though GFO, until the incident with McQuillan and Geezer I actually thought he wasn't too bad. Maybe it was a spark that made me look at him and now no matter who he is in the middle for, he is dire. I don't comment on refs at all. It's unfair as they have enough pressure and a thankless job, but that muppet is truly poor and yet despite that we managed to beat him by, with a few exceptions, not giving him clear chances to stop us. I'll take that. He's like that other idiot Cassidy and his brutal performance again on Sunday. Nuff said.
I also saw the following on Twitter which I thought was quite funny:

"Not a Kildare or Armagh supporter but I had to message the GaA about the horrible refereeing standard at their game on Saturday evening. He didn't seem to understand allowing for conditions. He also didn't seem to realise that the same rules applied to both teams. Their reply was as expected "Thank you for contacting us. We cannot comment on individuals contributing to our games and hope you realise the importance of each individual involved. Without these members of our organisation would not continue to function". I just replied , aye but if you turn supporters away from watching or attending because of stupid officials where will the money come from to keep your precious organisation running? Silence. What a surprise"

Referee's have a thankless job but I think they need to own their mistakes and come out and say "Sorry, I was wrong" but when they are not held accountable they can make the same mistake as many times as they want. As someone has said on here the referees and their calls are borderline cheating and to make matters worse they go around calling themselves members of the GAA. Then of course there are Umpires who can't even call a goal or point accurately.
 

Big Jim

Well-Known Member
The discussion on Ethan is interesting and also quite civilised for some reason. I like his style and vision - funny quote for someone who wears glasses.............. ok I digress! Maybe I'm looking for a defence for the lad, but to me his little brain farts when he finds himself in midfield is because he doesn't expect to be there. it's almost a case of "oh shit I need to get back to the goals. Where the hell is my man off the shoulder?" He looks around a few times before rushing to lay the ball off and get back. If a runner stayed with him - maybe that's what is supposed to happen, it could be effective. I'm just glad to see him back on the field. His strength has never been questioned. Blaine needs to be there too. Could he play a defensive role, so that when Ethan makes his run, he just slots back in as the cover? If this becomes reality, remind me to do the lottery numbers (again)!
 

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
The discussion on Ethan is interesting and also quite civilised for some reason. I like his style and vision - funny quote for someone who wears glasses.............. ok I digress! Maybe I'm looking for a defence for the lad, but to me his little brain farts when he finds himself in midfield is because he doesn't expect to be there. it's almost a case of "oh shit I need to get back to the goals. Where the hell is my man off the shoulder?" He looks around a few times before rushing to lay the ball off and get back. If a runner stayed with him - maybe that's what is supposed to happen, it could be effective. I'm just glad to see him back on the field. His strength has never been questioned. Blaine needs to be there too. Could he play a defensive role, so that when Ethan makes his run, he just slots back in as the cover? If this becomes reality, remind me to do the lottery numbers (again)!

I feel bad for Blaine because he has endured so much criticism on here some was his fault and some was not. He put in an exceptional performance against Dublin and even before that he was showing signs of improvement even last year. He wasn't in goal for Monaghan and it goes to show you how much he genuinely was missed - no harm to Magill a young lad with a future I hope. Didn't Benny Tierney let in 3 on his debut?

At the same time I guess we are being hypocrites as we have criticised McGeeney for not making the changes when needed. As hard as it is on Hughes management have to be cut-throat with the players, if we want to win these changes have to be made, it is the nature of the game regardless of its amateur status. Hughes is limited in the distance he is able to kick the ball, is hesitant and kicks the ball away needlessly at times. Sure, some of these things can be worked on but when we are on the cusp of having a real quality team that can challenge for honours if you have limitations you are going to be cut from the team. Undoubtedly there will be chances for Hughes again in the future so he just needs to stick at it and make himself better.

I have exactly the same thoughts about Rafferty as you Jim about Rafferty, I need to watch the game again but he soloed the ball up the pitch and one of the players were caught with possession and Rafferty didn't know what to do. That could have been costly. That being said Rafferty does have a physical presence in goal, high balls in and he should be able to cope with them and has a huge kick-out to go with it. Not a fan of him going forward, perhaps once he settles in goals and starts getting confident in that a roaming role can be introduced. Does anyone know if he was roaming forward against Mayo?
 

gael_force_orchard

Well-Known Member
Funny thing is though GFO, until the incident with McQuillan and Geezer I actually thought he wasn't too bad. Maybe it was a spark that made me look at him and now no matter who he is in the middle for, he is dire. I don't comment on refs at all. It's unfair as they have enough pressure and a thankless job, but that muppet is truly poor and yet despite that we managed to beat him by, with a few exceptions, not giving him clear chances to stop us. I'll take that. He's like that other idiot Cassidy and his brutal performance again on Sunday. Nuff said.
I also saw the following on Twitter which I thought was quite funny:

"Not a Kildare or Armagh supporter but I had to message the GaA about the horrible refereeing standard at their game on Saturday evening. He didn't seem to understand allowing for conditions. He also didn't seem to realise that the same rules applied to both teams. Their reply was as expected "Thank you for contacting us. We cannot comment on individuals contributing to our games and hope you realise the importance of each individual involved. Without these members of our organisation would not continue to function". I just replied , aye but if you turn supporters away from watching or attending because of stupid officials where will the money come from to keep your precious organisation running? Silence. What a surprise"
Other posters and yourself can correct me if im wrong and have orange tinted glasses on. Mc Quillan gave a yellow to hall and a scoring free when Hall was charged into in the first half. Second half Duffy contested a long ball, it broke and the Kildare man lay on the ball on the ground and lifted it off the deck, no free, 15 seconds later Flynn i believe it was slipped headed towards goal and got a free when no armagh man laid a hand on him. That 2 point swing via a free not given to Armagh yet one given to Kildare, left 2 points in the game rather than 4. It kept them in the game. Kildare hit 3 bad wides from 3 dubious and comical frees given in the first half. The ref had a huge impact on that game, he kept Kildare in it. We were actually 8 or 9 points the better team on Sat even though we won by 5 in the end. Hes just useless. I normally think as fans we have had a tendancy to blame a referee for some of our own misdemeanours, though on Saturday I left the ground thinking we really were on the end of a disgraceful performance. He done everything in his power to keep kildare in that game at our expense
 

PatMustard

Well-Known Member
On the Blaine/Ethan keeper thing. Is there any rule against players alternating between outfield and goalkeeper?

Could Blaine, say play wing back, then swop shirts with Ethan, who comes outfield for a while?

Or would that be considered as a substitution?

Answers on a postcard.
 

Armagh_paul

Well-Known Member
On the Blaine/Ethan keeper thing. Is there any rule against players alternating between outfield and goalkeeper?

Could Blaine, say play wing back, then swop shirts with Ethan, who comes outfield for a while?

Or would that be considered as a substitution?

Answers on a postcard.

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