Is it time for change?

Is it time to seek a new manager for the senior team?

  • Yes

    Votes: 35 53.8%

  • No

    Votes: 30 46.2%
  • Total voters
    65
P

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
It is a debating forum and people should be free to debate. It just so happens that a lot of people seem to detract from their own argument by the manner of their posts. I think that applies to both sides of this argument and possibly both sides of all arguments.
 
JoeH

JoeH

Well-Known Member
Peter grimes said:
I never said that any county/club did publish this detail. But without it being published how can anybody say that informed decisions are made?

This is especially relevant when we are told of reports of what management are paid or what they contribute to fundraising. It’s all hearsay.

It is laughable to pretend that the payments don’t exist or that informed decisions are made.

If the the structure is that the delegate votes based on advices of the club committee and that the club committee reflects the majority opinion within the club then show me what information ordinary club members are given?
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The information the ordinary club member can get is available via their club
They just need to ask I suppose
 
G

GAAGael

Active Member
Peter grimes said:
It is a debating forum and people should be free to debate. It just so happens that a lot of people seem to detract from their own argument by the manner of their posts. I think that applies to both sides of this argument and possibly both sides of all arguments.
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Free to debate but then throw a snide comment ‘why mention it at all’. But guess that only applies to views that align with your own agenda.
 
P

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
GAAGael said:
Free to debate but then throw a snide comment ‘why mention it at all’. But guess that only applies to views that align with your own agenda.
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It’s not “snide”.

The debate is being polluted by both sides. The no smoke without fire line is being used or implied by each side as if that equally pointless argument couldn’t be used by the other side.

I’m applying that logic to both sides. In fact I have said that I have voted against Geezer staying on and I engaged on the subject of the quality of debate to criticise someone who launched an outright attack on Geezer.

For that reason alone I cannot see where you are coming from on the issue of only critiquing those with views that “don’t align” with my own.

Then there is the separate issue of the the plain difference between silencing someone and asking them why they have posted something that doesn’t make sense.
 
P

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
JoeH said:
The information the ordinary club member can get is available via their club
They just need to ask I suppose
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So anyone can ask their club and get a breakdown of what the management are paid, the overall cost of running the team, the funds that are raised and how much of that would dry up if there was a managerial change?

Neither you nor I believe that info is freely available. But that is the basis that some are arguing for a retention. It cannot therefore be an informed decision.

This broader issue is not unique to our county or this management team but the fact that the vagueness around the issue is being used by some as a reason to retain is unique. I’m not comfortable with that.

The don’t ask, don’t look, keep vague, nod and wink imply basis of decision making never looks smart in the retrospective lense.
 
JoeH

JoeH

Well-Known Member
Peter grimes said:
So anyone can ask their club and get a breakdown of what the management are paid, the overall cost of running the team, the funds that are raised and how much of that would dry up if there was a managerial change?

Neither you nor I believe that info is freely available. But that is the basis that some are arguing for a retention. It cannot therefore be an informed decision.

This broader issue is not unique to our county or this management team but the fact that the vagueness around the issue is being used by some as a reason to retain is unique. I’m not comfortable with that.

The don’t ask, don’t look, keep vague, nod and wink imply basis of decision making never looks smart in the retrospective lense.
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Peter

You seem like a well informed knowledgeable person
No team, club or county, gives out details on team management expenses

There are always stories and I've heard
 
P

Peter grimes

Well-Known Member
JoeH said:
Peter

You seem like a well informed knowledgeable person
No team, club or county, gives out details on team management expenses

There are always stories and I've heard
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Yeah I know that. Just bemused that some posters seemed to think you could just ask for it and that it would be available. Even more incredibly that something like this that is cloaked in murk and shadow could ever be the basis of decision making and then to claim that it is an informed or even democratic decision!
 
S

Slieve Gullion

Member
There are a lot of short memories around Armagh at the moment.

If we look at the journey McGeeney has taken this Armagh squad on - where they were and how glacial the progress was - it seems bizarre to be demainding a change at this point. A lot of people are taking for granted the body of work that it took to put this group of players in a position to be going toe to toe with the best teams in the country every day out.

If there are tweaks needed to take them the last couple of percent - if they have the ability to do that - then the man who built the team should get the opportunity to find the missing pieces.
 
G

GAAGael

Active Member
Peter grimes said:
It’s not “snide”.

The debate is being polluted by both sides. The no smoke without fire line is being used or implied by each side as if that equally pointless argument couldn’t be used by the other side.

I’m applying that logic to both sides. In fact I have said that I have voted against Geezer staying on and I engaged on the subject of the quality of debate to criticise someone who launched an outright attack on Geezer.

For that reason alone I cannot see where you are coming from on the issue of only critiquing those with views that “don’t align” with my own.

Then there is the separate issue of the the plain difference between silencing someone and asking them why they have posted something that doesn’t make sense.
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Whatever makes you sleep at night. Everyone has an agenda. Your attempt at getting your point across is lost among paragraphs of pure wobble.

There's many spouts of outakes on this management fiasco, with the only people in the know being Kieran and the county executive. What gives you the 'know' to squash others views when you're likely just as much in the dark?
 
Diarmi

Diarmi

Well-Known Member
Slieve Gullion said:
There are a lot of short memories around Armagh at the moment.

If we look at the journey McGeeney has taken this Armagh squad on - where they were and how glacial the progress was - it seems bizarre to be demainding a change at this point. A lot of people are taking for granted the body of work that it took to put this group of players in a position to be going toe to toe with the best teams in the country every day out.

If there are tweaks needed to take them the last couple of percent - if they have the ability to do that - then the man who built the team should get the opportunity to find the missing pieces.
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Where was the team when he took over? Are you saying they were in a bad place worse than now? How long do you give him?
 
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