National Football League 2024

[Armaghball]

Watch it again on BBC iplayer. It was Louth who were overly defensive and broke on the counter, we were the team in control of possession for the vast majority. For the most part it was us trying to do the breaking down.

And so, I will reiterate exactly what I said above:

"Just attacking more" doesn't get around defences of that type. It requires, playing round the edges, attempting to burst through lines, maybe failing 2 or 3 or more times, resetting, going back and sideways if necessary to move the defence into a new position and trying again.... Or turning over possession and countering when the defence is out of possession.... Or winning contested kickouts in midfield as there will be more space against the defence.

If you don't understand this then it's on you.


I'm making no claims here that we played well nor did a good job at breaking down Monaghan. But it's January and ba jaysus even last year's 2 AI finalists were beat. It's a building process to peak at the right time.

Any decent teams tanks that Louth side by 10 at least. But 2 points on the board we go again

 

[Armaghball]

Exactly this. Well said. Patronising posts that think that people just want Armagh to blindly attack more, miss the point. We played exactly the same way against Monaghan last year and for large parts of the league and championship. As you say starting two defenders at wing forward, when playing at home to Louth isn't a good signal. Going back to the keeper when we are under zero pressure just slows everything down. We've seen that we aren't very good at scoring when the opposition are back and set up, so why do we slow it down and give them more time to get set? Have we looked to fix that in preseason? Time will tell and hopefully when we get more players back, we'll see more of that. If Turbo had scored those goals it would have been a far better performance and score line. Looking forward to the Meath game.

I thought Blaine Hughes had a good game back, judged one dangerous ball in well and distributed well, but wasn't under much pressure from his kick outs (don't think he hit any long at all). One thing we missed from Rafferty was his height under the dropping ball over the cross bar, as there was one and maybe a second that Rafferty would have been able to catch and save from points.

We’ll forgive Blaine for not saving points. He might save a few penalties later in the year

 

[BananaMan]

Exactly this. Well said. Patronising posts that think that people just want Armagh to blindly attack more, miss the point. We played exactly the same way against Monaghan last year and for large parts of the league and championship. As you say starting two defenders at wing forward, when playing at home to Louth isn't a good signal. Going back to the keeper when we are under zero pressure just slows everything down. We've seen that we aren't very good at scoring when the opposition are back and set up, so why do we slow it down and give them more time to get set? Have we looked to fix that in preseason? Time will tell and hopefully when we get more players back, we'll see more of that. If Turbo had scored those goals it would have been a far better performance and score line. Looking forward to the Meath game.

I thought Blaine Hughes had a good game back, judged one dangerous ball in well and distributed well, but wasn't under much pressure from his kick outs (don't think he hit any long at all). One thing we missed from Rafferty was his height under the dropping ball over the cross bar, as there was one and maybe a second that Rafferty would have been able to catch and save from points.

Some people most definitely do want Armagh to just blindly attack more, if you don't then the post wasn't directed at you. If your point is that we need to go about things quicker then I don't disagree.

But we aren't going to dictate how teams like Louth want to defend, we can catch them out of shape with turnovers or winning long contested kickouts but other than that they will be set defensively.

Also agreed on Blaine Hughes.

 

[BananaMan]

Any decent teams tanks that Louth side by 10 at least. But 2 points on the board we go again

Would that include Derry who beat them by 3 last year?
In championship football you're probably right but not January/February league football.

 

[ShiftYa]

Watch it again on BBC iplayer. It was Louth who were overly defensive and broke on the counter, we were the team in control of possession for the vast majority. For the most part it was us trying to do the breaking down.

And so, I will reiterate exactly what I said above:

"Just attacking more" doesn't get around defences of that type. It requires, playing round the edges, attempting to burst through lines, maybe failing 2 or 3 or more times, resetting, going back and sideways if necessary to move the defence into a new position and trying again.... Or turning over possession and countering when the defence is out of possession.... Or winning contested kickouts in midfield as there will be more space against the defence.

If you don't understand this then it's on you.


I'm making no claims here that we played well nor did a good job at breaking down Monaghan. But it's January and ba jaysus even last year's 2 AI finalists were beat. It's a building process to peak at the right time.

Apologies for not “understanding”, anyone with a different opinion mustn’t be as highly intelligent as yourself.

Funny how a Kerry team can field 6 forwards and put a high press on the same team and rack up 5-24. While we claim to have one of the best forward units in the country and can only manage 12 points.

We either have piss poor forwards or setting up in the complete wrong way.

 

[Berfaboy77]

I decided to sleep on it before posting . I was very frustrated coming out of the AG last night, the 1st half was as poor as I have seen us play in years. What really annoys me is how slow and lethargic our build up play is, Armagh aren’t necessarily playing any different in terms of tactics to say the likes of Monaghan or Derry, the difference is both those teams really go for scores with pace and precision when they get any sniff whatsoever. I think Louth contributed to a poor spectacle but can u blame them, they were serious underdogs.

On the night it’s hard to pick out a motm, probably soupy who got 3 gr8 scores in 2nd half. I thought Grugan did well in fits and starts. Geezer is getting a lot of stick at the moment, people pissed off at paying 18 quid want some form of entertainment & excitement and this is adding to the negative noise.

I watched the Monaghan game when I got some, it was gr8 to watch 2 teams going for it. And a few exciting new young lads coming through for them!

Big improvement needed next week….

 

[Ná habair é]

Frustrated, confused, delighted, relieved etc etc The rollercoaster of emotions of being an Armagh supporter took off in high winds last night in Armagh. Enjoy the ride everybody

Room for improvement all over the pitch but 2pts gained and we go again next week.

 

[Patrick-Armagh]

We’ll forgive Blaine for not saving points. He might save a few penalties later in the year

Not having a go at him, but more just pointing out what you miss when not having a big aul huure in goals.

 

[Muckser]

Not having a go at him, but more just pointing out what you miss when not having a big aul huure in goals.

Blaina made a low save that Rafferty would a struggled to do so it's horses fir courses I guess.

 

[Patrick-Armagh]

Some people most definitely do want Armagh to just blindly attack more, if you don't then the post wasn't directed at you. If your point is that we need to go about things quicker then I don't disagree.

But we aren't going to dictate how teams like Louth want to defend, we can catch them out of shape with turnovers or winning long contested kickouts but other than that they will be set defensively.

Also agreed on Blaine Hughes.

You'd like to think we'd better at this stage at breaking down teams with men behind the ball. We see other top sides do it more consistently and most of us believe that we have some very good forwards. So it's frustrating that we don't do it more. Yes, it's the first game and there's rustiness, but it's been a consistent failing in our play for a number of years and you'd hope that it would start to come right at some stage.

 

[Diarmi]

So you can say t about the management but not the players. Got it

Firstly, I didn't say the management were a disgrace, a proper reading of the message would have told you that. Secondly, as was already pointed out the management are getting paid. Thirdly there is a massive difference in a lad making a mistake on the field or having a bad game and a management team having months to evaluate shortcomings with a setup and coming up with nothing new but persisting with failed tactics of the past.
There are posters on here who do not want any critical comments on our management and attack anyone who has anything negative to say. I am dubious about their motives as they have stymied a lot of debate and put off many others from posting. Well, you can attack me all you want, I'm too old to be bullied so I will continue to point out what I see, that is the idea of the forum.

 

[GAAGael]

And what lessons are those?
Don't foul Conor McManus for the last kick of the game?
Don't miss 2 penalties?

If you think that loss came down to those two incidents which accumulated to over 5 mins of the 90 mins + penalties, you need to give your head a wobble.

 

[GAAGael]

You'd like to think we'd better at this stage at breaking down teams with men behind the ball. We see other top sides do it more consistently and most of us believe that we have some very good forwards. So it's frustrating that we don't do it more. Yes, it's the first game and there's rustiness, but it's been a consistent failing in our play for a number of years and you'd hope that it would start to come right at some stage.

The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over again and expecting different results. Armagh in a nutshell under the current regime.

 

[JoeH]

Firstly, I didn't say the management were a disgrace, a proper reading of the message would have told you that. Secondly, as was already pointed out the management are getting paid. Thirdly there is a massive difference in a lad making a mistake on the field or having a bad game and a management team having months to evaluate shortcomings with a setup and coming up with nothing new but persisting with failed tactics of the past.
There are posters on here who do not want any critical comments on our management and attack anyone who has anything negative to say. I am dubious about their motives as they have stymied a lot of debate and put off many others from posting. Well, you can attack me all you want, I'm too old to be bullied so I will continue to point out what I see, that is the idea of the forum.

Diarmi

You did include this sentence in an earlier post:
That was a disgrace tonight and I don't mean the players.
If it's not the players then who are you referring to?

Just saying

 

[Armaghniac]

Mass defences are a reality for all teams now. Victory comes about from you scoring more when you go up the field than the other lot do when they attack you. So you can win by reducing their turnovers below the number that you make, by accurate shooting, and by winning more kickouts. Armagh players ran into traffic multiple times yesterday, more or less ensuring a turnover, and the ball is hard to win back. But there is hope of sharper play as the season goes on and the ball being released a few seconds earlier before the defence close in.
This being Div 2 we can play poorly and still squeeze a win, that doesn't happen so much in Div 1. We could have been caught yesterday, but we have two points and obvious scope for improvement and hopefully we'll see that improvement in a week.

 

[Hoops]

It’s simply not the game to criticise how attacking our game play is. We had an experimental team who started out uphill, against the wind, with Louth playing every man behind the ball. Louths early chances came after poor handling errors in our attacking play, which gave them a lead to cling on to and made the situation worse. Handling errors in the first half of league football in January are survivable. No one was a disgrace.

Having said that, starting anyone in the forwards who can’t score is a bad idea. As conaty showed last night, you can get good footballers to work hard defensively, so you don’t need to sacrifice a footballer for a work horse. Wouldn’t it have been lovely to see him at 10 with Oisin at 14. Maybe next time.

There were a lot of other concerns out there too, hopefully it’s day 1 problems and we see a bit more next time. Thank god Louth didn’t score a goal or we really would have been in trouble.

 

[niall1980]

Firstly, I didn't say the management were a disgrace, a proper reading of the message would have told you that. Secondly, as was already pointed out the management are getting paid. Thirdly there is a massive difference in a lad making a mistake on the field or having a bad game and a management team having months to evaluate shortcomings with a setup and coming up with nothing new but persisting with failed tactics of the past.
There are posters on here who do not want any critical comments on our management and attack anyone who has anything negative to say. I am dubious about their motives as they have stymied a lot of debate and put off many others from posting. Well, you can attack me all you want, I'm too old to be bullied so I will continue to point out what I see, that is the idea of the forum.

Fair enough. I don’t think management are exempt from criticism. Neither are players. I should clarify tho. Giving up on tracking back and pulling out of tackles is, in my opinion, a disgrace. That’s what I meant. And I saw some of that last night. The payment thing is a non issue tho

 

[Diarmi]

Diarmi

You did include this sentence in an earlier post:
That was a disgrace tonight and I don't mean the players.
If it's not the players then who are you referring to?

Just saying

Absolutely, the reference is to how we were set up not to the individual. I know Geezer quite well and have no personal issue with the fella and would not call him a disgrace (def not to his face).

 

[Wide ball]

I think it's fair to have criticism of management for the way we set up and you can't blame them for individual mistakes but playing 2 half backs in the forward line is madness imo, especially against division 2 opposition, I'd understand if we played a Kerry to have someone on Gavin white, but for me we have more than enough hard working towards who can track up and down the field and tackle who can kick a score too Ie. Hall, duffy, Kelly to name a few. The first half against that wind wasn't as bad as some make out imo we should of had 2 goals, but second half is madness, we had the wind and played the same way and only for soupy shooting well we would of been beaten, we should of had more players on who are comfortable with shooting, that wind was that strong it would of taken the mass defence out of it, think management where very slow to make changes too, think mcpartlan and a forward should of come on at half time. It is worrying to see these tactics but I just hope we have evolve more on the coming weeks, Blaine was excellent and was good to see him back

 

[Leamington Gael]

When you look at what Kerry and Dublin do to teams like Louth they hit them hard and early, Dublin especially always rattled a couple of goals early which killed the game and didn't allow opponents any confidence which Armagh tend to give opponents.

When Armagh squeezed up on Louth they couldn't get out, it's a high risk strategy but one that suits our players and their physicality. As soon as we went two up we dropped of their kick out again, why? Keep the pressure on and make it a 3-4 point lead.

Lots of players to come back and 2 points on a blustery horrible night is the most important